this one is 5 stars . . . my roses were crap until i noticed that i wasn't folding early enough and also after the 1st couple of turns, i put it inbetween my left hand pointer & middle finger (and then these fingers are the base) & my left thumb is holding the center.
lol - g/luck trying to figure out what i'm saying . . . but this keeps my flowers from being 4" high!
i practiced several (maybe 20?) times before i started gluing them.
edit . . . here's a good tut for a loose/floppy one . . . http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73S_F...eature=related